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Forums : MFLS Central Forum Thread : Klinsmann Question
    [thread started by Dynamo Salem on Fri 7/24 23:48 ET]
    [moderated by 1860 Oakland, SDFC Macross]
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from Dynamo Salem
on Fri 7/24 23:48 ET
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OK, so what will it take for Klinsmann to get fired? Murder? You know aside from murdering the dreams of US fans, but real murder.

At this point, with Sunil Gulati part of a horrible global conspiracty to defraud the soccer playing world, he probabay does not have a lot of time to worry about a national team coach.

I do think/wish that we should stop pretending that anything that Klinsmann is doing on the national team level is any better than Bradley or Arena. And at this point I think both Bradley and Areana are better.
from FC Byrd Turgler
on Sat 7/25 0:21 ET
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Klinsmann faces a real challenge to his legitimacy, and right as Feilhaber strikes from distance, I could not sum it up better. The fact that JK did not blood an adequate replacement for Beckerman and continues to bring in a luxury player when there's an OBVIOUSLY younger, fitter, faster, and all-around better solution to play at the 6 (or wherever you want to put him) is a massive embarrassment.

Much like any coach, he's got his guys. Beckerman and Wondolowski are two examples that make him look really bad. As for the comparisons with Bradley and Arena...eh? Similarly successful, and he's been good about getting some high ceiling dual nationals to commit to the US. Unfortunately, his taste in grinders and glue guys looks half-ass at best.

Selfishly, I'm glad GC ended like this. Now that I live in LA, I'll probably get to watch a US-Mexico playoff at the Rose Bowl, and that's pretty awesome. That said, I'm sick of JK's lesser evaluations of high ceiling and in-form players like Feilhaber and OG. I mean, seriously? Duh, dumbass.
from Seattle SC
on Sat 7/25 5:04 ET
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dual nationals don't impress me, I'll just leave it at that.
from The Laws of Lalas
on Sat 7/25 11:06 ET
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i feel like i saw somewhere that Benny is alleged to have been
one of the main sources who criticized Klinsy in that infamous
article that came out shortly after he took over the team.
from Dynamo Salem
on Sat 7/25 11:30 ET
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Another problem I have, and this is a massive

The US player base has never been deeper. There
are more Americans playing domestically and abroad
now than any time ever, and yet, right now, it
looks like we don't. We have to find German dual
nationals? Outrageous Ridiculous Insane!

Player development is taking a turn in the US in
the MLS academies. Klinsmann disses MLS regularly,
BUT the reality is that MLS is now developing the
next generation of internationals. This Gold Cup,
to me, is the peak of what happens when a euro-
snob has to face the reality of competing with the
low-lifes in our own conference. On the plus side,
the team doesn't took over-trained and wilt at the
end of the game, on the negative side, they don't
look like they know how to play each other.

This is another problem I have and it is a big
one. I really don't think any coach should have
two world cup cycles. The world cup comes and
goes, if we do well or poorly or somewhere in
between, it is time to clear the decks and move
forward with a new coach.

One of the chat shows was lamenting who would you
replace Klinsmann with, as if he were the only
coach in the world. There are loads of good
coaches in the world and a bunch in MLS.

Maybe I'm just pissed.


Well, yes I am pissed.

I guess perhaps my big question is this. Does the
team perform better with Klinsmann now than when
Arena coached it with fewer resources. In my mind
hands down, those Arena teams were way better:
played with purpose, and with a clear and well
executed game plan. I am tired, so tired, of
watching these highly trained players run onto the
field and not find each other with simple passes
because the coach is shoehorning them into
unfamiliar roles and it seems like they have no
obvious game plan at all.
from Seattle SC
on Sat 7/25 14:28 ET
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^ - agreed.
from FC Byrd Turgler
on Sat 7/25 14:40 ET
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Fabian Johnson doesn't do anything for you? On the dual-national thing, it's open for debate, and a lot of the yield of that will be determined in 3 years. One thing I do feel strongly about- the kid whose dad was a serviceman and grew up in Germany is no more or less American than the son of an Iowa corn farmer or a kid born in El Paso whose parents were both born in Mexico. Sure, each is a vastly different experience, but that's America...it's a big place.
from Seattle SC
on Sat 7/25 16:18 ET
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Nah, FJ can play for Germany, like he did up until he wasn't called up by them so then 'chose' to represent the USA.

My dad grew up in Germany on a military base ... side note: playing American football his junior high team won the 3ID (3rd Infantry Division) "Marne" division championship and went on to win the National (Germany) Championship, I have cool pictures of him in the newspapers since he was one of the best players ... and he's definitely American.

I don't know, if I was an American that had been born in Germany I certainly wouldn't represent another country internationally, wouldn't need anyone to beg me to play for the USA, and wouldn't need to fail or not get the chance at representing another country before using USA as "Plan B" ...

(note: not specific to any one player and isn't across the board, but sums up my thoughts on the topic.)
from Weirder Bremen
on Sat 7/25 16:29 ET
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Ives ranted extensively on Klinsy in his latest
podcast. He also wrote a similar article for
gol.com. His main criticism was starting the young
CB's and not OG. He said Klinsy is like a
blackjack player who hit on 18 and won a couple of
times but lost this time. Ives can rant with the
best of them.

I would add that Altidore is a valuable player for
the US team and when he's out of form there just
isn't an adequate replacement in kind. The USA is
a little thin on forwards and MLS isn't developing

Vermees, Kreis, Schmid, Pareja, and Olsen might be
suitable replacements for Klinsmann.
from The Laws of Lalas
on Sat 7/25 18:47 ET
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i do not like it when people say the dual nationals are not "real" Americans. who gets to define what makes a "real" American anyways? what makes America great to me is our diversity. i want to field the best team we can within the rules. at the last WC, i would argue our two best players were Jones and Johnson, both of whom were born in Germany. Brooks also scored the game winner vs. Ghana and Green had one off the bench vs. Belgium. Both of them were also born in Germany. Altidore's parents immigrated from Haiti. Howard's mother is Hungarian. Bedoya's father is Colombian. Omar Gonzalez's parents are both from Mexico. Nick Rimando is part Mexican and part Filipino. Yedlin is half Latvian and a quarter Native-American. I could go on and on. i can't imagine a more American team. Klinsy makes some poor roster selections and some questionable decisions tactically, but trying to find the best players possible regardless of where they were born is not one of his flaws in my opinion. in fact, i would say it is the best thing he has brought to a team that used to shun such guys in favor of so-called "real" Americans.
from Arrows SC
on Sat 7/25 20:36 ET
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This may be my own point of view, but when I see "real Americans", I don't read into it anyone questioning anyone's heritage or allegiance. Instead, I think it's about mining the Bundesliga for US national team players, and not mining MLS. With few exceptions, Kinsmann isn't mining France or Italy or England or other European countries for potential national team players. So I disagree, LoL, I think I can imagine a more "American" team.

I was excited about the Klinsmann era. I'm not anymore. I don't think he moved the needle. I really thought he would, and I'm disappointed. It just doesn't feel like we got what we thought we were going to get.
from Seattle SC
on Sat 7/25 20:40 ET
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I don't think anyone but LoL has said anything about "'real' Americans", at least I'm not seeing anything?
from The Laws of Lalas
on Sat 7/25 20:50 ET
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my apologies as i did not mean to imply anyone on this site
had said it, but rather i was referring to the fact it is something
one sees in almost every comment section and forums about
the team on the big soccer sites. i stand by the sentiment
though that dual nationals are some of our best players and
that we should look at every player who is eligible regardless
of where they were born or what their first language is. i don't
think anyone disagrees with that but rather thinks Klinsy
overvalues german born guys, and i agree with that.
from Seattle SC
on Sat 7/25 20:59 ET
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I can only speak for myself but my thing is about being first choice.

As I said this doesn't apply across the board, but seems it does for a majority.

Once they realize they aren't good enough for 'their' country of choice, they accept an offer - in my view 'begging - to join the USMNT. I don't think that's a strength or a good thing for the program, I view that as a weakness and inferiority complex. "Oh, he's not good enough for the country he chose to represent so let's go get him! He must be better than what we have." ... and from the players point of view; "I'm not good enough to play for the country I want to play for, but I must be better than the Americans and I bet I can play for them."

I would also say that the last WC wasn't the success that was implied.

For a fairly meaningless analogy - I'm not married - for those married would you want:

A. The girl you grew up with and you have always been her first choice?

B. The girl that tries and wants to be with another guy but was turned down or he didn't acknowledge her so she 'picked' you with you knowing she picked you because you're easy and would grovel?
from Seattle SC
on Sat 7/25 21:04 ET
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The above has nothing to do with being a citizen or not, obviously. Has everything to do with choice.

Not where one was born but who they choose to represent. Being Plan B doesn't move the program forward.

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